Building Bridges: Rania Mustafa on Identity and Advocacy in the Diaspora

SPEAKER_01 0:13

Marhaban, welcome to Siddhi Stories, a podcast dedicated to amplifying the voices and highlighting the achievements of Palestinian women. I'm your host, Leila, and today we have an incredible guest with us. Joining us is Ranya Mustafa, the executive director of the Palestinian American Community Center, otherwise known as PAC. She is a dynamic leader committed to preserving and celebrating Palestinian identity, empowering our community, and creating opportunities for growth and connection.

SPEAKER_00 0:38

Hi, Ranya. Hi, Leila. Thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_01 0:41

Thank you so much for coming. I'm so excited to have you. Um, for people who don't know out there, Ranya has always been one of my biggest inspirations and one of my biggest role models, even though she's only a year older than me. Um, I've always looked up to her. And when I thought of creating this podcast, I was like automatically, immediately, I need to have Ranya Mustafa. I would love to hear what she has to say and share with everyone what you have to say and your story.

SPEAKER_00 1:10

Um I love you, Dana, and you're my inspiration. Thank you for everything you do.

SPEAKER_01 1:15

Oh, you just I would love for you to share a little bit about yourself.

SPEAKER_00 1:19

Sure. So my name is Rani Mustafa, as you said. Um, I grew up in New Jersey. I was born and raised here. My mom is from Iram, uh, which is it used to be Kadal Ilkutz, so it's to be around the Elkutz area, but um, because of the wall and everything, it's Kadaramala now. My dad's from the Hamas. My dad actually was born in America, but went back and actually lived in Iram. Yeah, and then came back here for college. And then my parents have been here since they got married.

SPEAKER_01 1:43

Yeah, there's a lot of Khamsa in New Jersey. So, growing up, what role did Palestinian culture and heritage play in your household?

SPEAKER_00 1:50

I think New Jersey's always been like a little Palestine in many ways. I know now because of the work of PAC and the work of the community, it's formerly known as Little Palestine. Shout out PAC. Shout out Pac. Growing up, it always felt like a home away from home. I remember when we used to have even family coming to visit us from the blad. They used to feel like they were walking in the streets of Ramallah. It always for me was very special because you could walk into the streets and and walk into the stores and you hear Arabi and you can talk to people and you can order things that you'd only have back home. So it always had that special feel, and I think I'm actually very proud of the progress our community has made, uh, especially over the last 10 years. The area that's now known as Little Palestine has drastically transformed and has very much become Raballah in many, many ways now. And so it's just it's really nice kind of being in this area and being able to see this. I grew up, I was born and raised in this in Patterson, New Jersey. So for me, I kind of take it for granted. I always remember how lucky we are when um I talk to people who, you know, either did not grow up with Arabs or did not grow up in the area. I just really appreciate it even more.

SPEAKER_01 2:51

Yeah, I can live anywhere if it has a big Palestinian or Arab community, Muslim community. But outside of that, you can't catch me there. I've gotten just too comfy with like being able to just get Schnafa on a Friday evening. Um You're now the executive director of PAC. Can you tell us about your journey to this role? And for those who are listening that don't know what PAC is, can you give it a little bit of an explanation?

SPEAKER_00 3:17

Sure. Uh so PAC was founded in 2014. Uh, we did things a little backwards where the board first they purchased the building, then they created a board, and then they uh they re- they registered the organization with the board and the building. So it was really an interesting process of kind of knowing that we they wanted something like this that existed, but they didn't know how it would look or what would what it would be. But they found the space to kind of make it happen. And then they hired me in August. So I had started fresh out of college. I had gotten a degree in applied psychology, and my goal was to go into community psychology. And in my head, it was kind of like I would take a gap year, I'd help this community project get off the ground, and then I'd go pursue um at the time when I wanted like my PhD in psychology. Uh, and then, you know, I think God had other plans. So um a year in, I decided I was like, you know what, this is actually a really cool project. Let me give this another year. Uh so I worked another year in, and then at two-year mark, I was like, you know what? I have to step away. Let me try to get into some of these programs. But of course, I applied to only the best community psychology programs in the country. Um, and I didn't get in. So then I said that this is a sign from God to just kind of take some more time on this. And then I actually then switched into getting a degree in management. I started off with a nonprofit management certification, and then that became into a master's um and then another certification. So that's that was basically like my journey into PAC. And then I just kept growing and realizing that, you know, a lot of my own passions fall in community development and community psychology, whether it be through formal education like getting my PhD or just practical knowledge like um what I was doing. In terms of PAC itself, so PAC is the Palestinian American Community Center. Our mission is to strengthen and sustain ties to Palestinian heritage while empowering the success and well-being of the entire community. We have four main focus areas. The first is educating about Palestine. So we really center Palestine in the work that we do. Uh, and we try to make sure that we're educating not only the non-Arabs or people who wouldn't know as much about the struggle, but specifically the Palestinians and Arabs too, kind of giving them an attachment to the struggle and an attachment to their identity. The second focus area is empowering the community, uh which may sound a little cliche, but the idea is basically that we're by the community for the community. So we're always trying to find ways to improve the community and we're taking the lead by the community. So if they say, oh, we really need this program, then we work together to make that program happen. We always give it what I say, the pack twist. So we try to, you know, make sure that it's accommodating for our Arab community and it's not something that's reinventing the wheel. Our third focus area is civic engagement, where we're working on uh, you know, working with the general community to educate them about civic edu uh civic engagement, make sure that people are registered to vote, uh, make sure that they understand the power that they have with their American privilege and how they could use it. Um, to inshallah see a free Palestine one day. Um, and to work on a lot of like local um and state level politics, being a representative for the Arab voice in many ways. And lastly, we have our focus area, which is building coalitions and socially serving the community. And so we do that by not reinventing the wheel, but by reaching out to other organizations and really being like a go-to hub for organizations and for our community members in terms of helping them meet their, meet their needs and what they need to do.

SPEAKER_01 6:42

Your work at PAC is so deeply rooted in serving the Palestinian community and creating a space for connection, education, and advocacy. How do you see identity influencing not just the mission of PAC, but also the way Palestinian Americans navigate their place in the diaspora?

SPEAKER_00 6:57

So, fun fact is that I actually did my master's thesis um on identity development and the idea of hyphenated identity. And so what I found in my honors thesis was basically that um in order to have like a health, the healthiest kind of hyphenated identity, which is like Palestinian American or Muslim American, it's to have a space to navigate that identity. So I feel like in many ways, like that's what inspires my work at PAC. It's kind of creating that safe space where people could navigate like who they are and what they can contribute to the world.

SPEAKER_01 7:31

I love that you said how your thesis was about dual identity, because that's a huge part of what this podcast is about. And that's also a huge part of what PAC does being Palestinian American community centered. And so, what's the PAC twist to make sure that, you know, that come to PAC really fully understand their Palestinian identity while also being their American identity?

SPEAKER_00 7:57

So, what we focus on is we kind of have different education programs focusing on different levels. So we have things as young as five years old, to as old as you want to be, uh, where we teach the Palestinian history. What does it mean to be Palestinian? What is Palestinian culture? That that is how we root a lot of people, their understanding of their identity and understanding of where they fall in this Palestinian struggle, while also tying it to a lot of social justice ideals, like, you know, tying it to the black struggle, tying it to the indigenous struggle, tying it to the Latino struggle, tying it to the immigrant justice struggle. So we we're always trying to also tie that while bringing in the idea that we all have American privilege and we're all living in this society, and most of us are American citizens, and how can we use that privilege to then advocate for the other part of our identity? So it's it's kind of like living in this middle world where it's like, you know, a lot of times people say, like, when you go to Palestine, you don't feel like you belong, when you're here, you don't feel like you belong. But then we kind of create this, I want to say, bubble where you feel like you could have both sides of your identity and then relate to other people that also have both sides of your identity and figure out how you could better the world and what's your place in this world in the larger scheme of things.

SPEAKER_01 9:09

No, for sure. Navigating the dual identity of being both Palestinian and American can be really complex. How do you personally navigate that?

SPEAKER_00 9:17

So it's not about equality, it's more about understanding the difference and the duality of your identity. So realizing that you do have two different identities and how they can merge together to make you who you are. So there's different kinds of identity. There's conflicted, where, for example, like I can't be Palestinian and American at the same time. I can't be Muslim and American at the same time. And then there's parallel where basically I'm Muslim in these scenarios and I'm American in these scenarios. I'm Palestinian in these scenarios and I'm American in these scenarios. But what integrated means is that I can show up as how I see Palestinian American in all scenarios, right? So it's not about equality necessarily, because I think especially in the last, you know, 15 months of a genocide, it's definitely difficult to have that sense of equality with your identity, especially when one part of your identity is literally killing another part of your identity. How do you balance both of those? For example, like I see me being proudly Palestinian actually very American, right? Because my idea and understanding of being American is that we are people from all different backgrounds that kind of came together, and this is who we are, and this is how we make up what American is, right? And this idea of even social justice, to me, that's that's American, right? So it's it's kind of understanding of how your outlook in the world doesn't contradict your two identities. Your two identities come together and they make you who you are as a person.

SPEAKER_01 10:40

I totally agree. Identity, especially for Palestinian youth, is largely shaped by the spaces and people around them. Having a strong sense of community can really make all the difference in the world, like just by feeling supported and feeling connected. How do you see these community spaces playing a role in preserving and strengthening Palestinian identity?

SPEAKER_00 10:59

So I think, like you said, like I think growing up for me, a I was always very proud to be Palestinian, but it was like there's some times where you could be extra-Palestinian, and there's some times where you had to be like a quieter Palestinian. What transformed things, not only for me, but I think the community at large, especially the youth, was that PAC emboldened a lot of people where you don't need to choose to be one identity. You could be both identities at all times, you know? Yeah. And it is beautiful. I see it. Like being at PAC for the last 10 years now, I see a lot of people that may have started with us when they were, you know, eight and now they're 18 or they were 10 and now they're 20, and seeing how they were able to navigate these last 10 years of their identity, having this safe space where now they go into society and they're so proud of who they are that it's like a ripple effect or a domino effect to everything else. Because not only are they proud of who they are, but they're suddenly a lot more confident. They come up as who they are. And then that leads to a lot more like successful things that they try to do. It leads to a lot more confidence. It leads to a lot more projecting, you know, goodness to the world or trying to realize, like, you know, I could do more stuff. Because if you're not feeling confident in yourself and if you're like, oh, I don't know who I am, you're you're gonna project that, right? But if you're feeling more confident in who you are, then you're able to, you know, take on more leadership roles. You're able to spend, you know, um expand your influence circles more. And I've definitely been seeing that. Like a lot of our youth have been involved in the center. Like I'm so proud of seeing their progression. And I always think, like, I wish I had a place like PAC growing up, you know? And the closest that we had was the masjid, which also obviously was amazing and did its part and I think made me who I am, right? And that's why I'm very comfortable in my identity. But I'm glad that now we also have this alternate venue, alternate location, alternate community space where people can navigate different parts of their identity, not only the religious parts.

SPEAKER_01 12:52

Yeah, seriously, I wish we had those spaces as a kid. I'm glad you all are doing the work that you're doing for not only your kids, but just for generations to come. So as we navigate our identities, storytelling becomes a powerful tool for preserving history and also shaping the future. Can you share with us what role storytelling has in the programs and initiatives at PAC?

SPEAKER_00 13:12

I think storytelling is the crux of everything that we do, right? Because that's like that's how we get our message across. Palestinian history is very much entrenched in oral history and oral storytelling. We always try to get give different platforms for either people coming to tell their own stories or retelling stories of the past or retelling stories that they've had in their families and in in generations. And I think that that's what makes her beautiful. Like down from like our folklore to our depca to just the songs that we sing or the ways or the weddings that we have or the practices and the cultural stuff that we do, all of it's entrenched in stories. Um, and I think that's what makes it beautiful. And then even when we're trying to explain our struggle to others, or try to explain to people, you know, what does it mean to be Palestinian or what does the Palestinian struggle look like, or what is, you know, the apartheid or the occupation, a lot of it is filled with stories. That's how we explain our struggle to people. That's how we get that a lot of people to at least enter into the idea of Palestinian solidarity, is through stories.

SPEAKER_01 14:12

Yeah, and usually our cities were the holders of that history and those stories.

SPEAKER_00 14:16

Can you share with us a story about your grandma? My grandma, my dad's mom is actually Venezuelan, so I forgot about that. Oh, so why didn't you call her? So we called her, like all my cousins and I always used to call her Siddha. That was the grandma I grew up with because she was in America with us. She spoke Arabic and she was Muslim. Uh, she converted.

SPEAKER_01 14:36

Did she meet your grandfather and then like they came here? Like, what did that look like?

SPEAKER_00 14:41

That's a whole story. Um I would love to hear. So basically, the story is that my grandfather, when he was a teen, he was the oldest of his family. And what they did at the time was that you would basically go on a ship and travel to Central America. Um, and no one knew where you were, what had happened. They didn't even know if you were dead or alive because you would disappear on a ship and they'd hear back from you months later whether you made it, whether you're alive. This is a very common story, which is actually like surprising because a lot of people don't know that, but there's a lot of Palestinian South American uh like marriages. So um my grandfather ended up going to Venezuela. My my dad's family's from Hamas. A lot of Mahamsa were doing that where they were just going to Venezuela. So he met my grandmother there and he got married, and he had my uncle and my aunt there, and then they decided to immigrate to America. So my dad and my uncle were born here, and then when my dad was four years old, my grandfather wanted his kids to go back to Palestine so they can learn the language and be in touch with their culture. So he sent them all to Palestine.

SPEAKER_01 15:45

And yeah, because they didn't have teaching, so they had to send their kids all the way back to Palestine.

SPEAKER_00 15:52

And then my mom's mom, my Palestinian grandma that uh grew up in Palestine, she's from actually my mom's from the Ram, but she grew up in Jinin, and my grandma's from Elbira. So my mom's a little bit all over Palestine. My grandmother, she got married young to my grandfather, and they were they lived in Janine until my mom was like in 11th grade, and then they went back to the Ram, and then my mom stayed there until she married my dad, and then they came to America.

SPEAKER_01 16:18

Thanks for sharing. I love hearing about your grandparents' background. It's so interesting to see what everyone's story was and how they came to America. Were there any traditions or fun memories that you carry with you that your city's passed on?

SPEAKER_00 16:32

My grandma actually, one of the fondest memories I had with her is she taught me how to sew.

unknown 16:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:37

Like Cities? No, so this is my um Venezuelan grandmother. So she loved to sew. We actually lived growing up, she was on the first floor and we were on the second floor. So anytime I'd come over, she'd get like cloth and then uh would show me how to make like baby clothes, like clothes for my dolls or something. That's always been something I personally held dear to my heart. And I actually grew up and I took sewing classes. A secret talent I have is I can actually make clothes. I don't do it often and I haven't done it in a while. But um, like I've made dresses, I've made skirts, I've made um, you know, different things, and and a lot of that comes from those times I had with my grandma.

SPEAKER_01 17:15

That's so special. That's so special that you get to carry that on. Is that going to be something that you teach your kids?

SPEAKER_00 17:23

I want to. Um, I definitely do because I I love it and I think it was it's a sweet story. Anytime I see any Barbie clothes, I remember my grandma, and I remember how she taught me how to make like little Barbie skirts and stuff. And my other grandmother, she's also very like nifty with her hands, so she knows how to crochet. She knows how to, she's the story always was that when she first got married, she was really young, so she was like 17 when she got married. She didn't know how to make dough. So she put the dough, and then every time she put dough, it just came out like play-doh on her hands. And she's like, What is happening? So she kept going back and forth, back and forth. And all day she went for hours, put more water, put more flour, put more water, put more flour until my grandfather came back. He at the time was working on the Oak Off, which is why they were in Janine. Um, he came back and he was like, What are you doing? And he showed her how to like do dough properly. So for me, anytime I make dough, I always remember that story of my grandma because she was saying how she learned how to make dough for my grandfather. And then she's like, We had so much dough that we gave it to the whole neighborhood because she just kept doing flour and water, flour and water, flour and water.

SPEAKER_01 18:26

That's so cute. That's so adorable. My God. I did that a lot too when I first got married, but then my grandmother taught me how to do it properly. It sounds like your grandmother played a really significant role in shaping who you are today. Like a little Ajina. Was there a woman or a mentor who shaped your path and really inspired you? It could be your grandparents, it doesn't have to be your grandmas.

SPEAKER_00 18:47

Honestly, my my my grandmother, I always really looked up to her growing up. She was like one of my favorite people. She passed away when I was in eighth grade, but it was such a turning point for me. Like she was super, super kind and always thoughtful and always thought about other people and always like tried to make the people around her feel special. That literally sounds so much like you. That's very sweet of you to say. I just loved her so much. I love how she made me feel. She was the kind of grandma that all her grandkids thought there they were her favorite. She always found like, you like this, so I'm gonna make this for you. You want this, I'm gonna make this for you. She's saying she's like, I bought this especially because I thought of you. So it was it was always like really sweet, and I think I like I took that to heart in a lot of ways, and I think I was like, I want to be that kind of person.

SPEAKER_01 19:31

Um and no, I literally always thought that you are someone who always has so much on your plate, Mashola. And you are able to, I know it's it's hard, but it always looks like from the outside that you seem to juggle it really well. And then on top of that, you're so sweet to everyone, always have a smile on your face, and then go out of your way to check in with people and remember things about people. That's so awesome that we get to know where it comes from.

SPEAKER_00 19:58

Thanks, Naila. That's so sweet of you. Um, I definitely that's it's something that's really important to me. I guess talking about it now is making me realize that I really did want to embody that, and that's what really made me feel very close to my grandma's because I always admired that of her. A quiet cute story. She used to be the one that because she's the Spanish one living in the Rams, but they used to know her as the candy lady because she would just give candy to all the kids in the neighborhood. People would come to her house just to give her candy, she'd be walking in the street and she'd just have candy in her bag. She just exuded kindness in every way. And when she passed away, like there were so many stories of kindness that came out after she passed away. And she was a woman of always simple means. She didn't have much, and you know, she had a very difficult life, and there was a lot of different things that happened to her that made things harder. But she always tried to give what she had. I think saying it out loud now, I realized that actually a lot of that I wanted to carry in who I am. I love that. And I'm so glad. What was her name? Graciela. Graciela, but she was going by Graciela Carmen Mustafa.

SPEAKER_01 21:05

Yeah, I love that. Even though she was Venezuelan, she really embodied that Palestinian heart of just full-on hospitality, full on kindness, yes, uh resilience, because you said she had a hard life, but yet she always had a smile on her face. That was so sweet and special. Thank you for sharing that. Of course. Um, as someone who is a leader in the community, a mom, a daughter, granddaughter, you know, you have so many different roles and responsibilities that you're always juggling. How do you manage to balance it all?

SPEAKER_00 21:34

I I struggle a lot, a lot, a lot. And I think um I think I also struggle with like this idea of like being kind to everyone, but sometimes I'm not kind to myself. And it's yeah, that's against the Burke.

SPEAKER_01 21:48

But no, go there, please, because that's that's very real.

SPEAKER_00 21:52

Yeah. I love being kind and I love being nice and I love giving, but it is sometimes at the expense of myself, at the expense of my family, at the expense of My well-being. I've been trying over the last few years to kind of reprioritize that because I think that in order for me to, you know, continue to give, I need to take care of myself, which is really hard on me, actually. I have a very hard time doing that. I don't know if it's because I'm the oldest. I don't know what it is, but I've always had this like desire to like help others and give for others, but I don't give that same grace to myself. So in terms of juggling, it's a constant struggle. But what I will say is alhamdulillah, Alhamdulillah, alhamdulillah, I have a lot of support. I live very close to my parents and my sisters, and they and my sisters live at home with my parents, so they help me a lot. My husband is super supportive and very helpful. He works from home a lot of the time. And, you know, we're, you know, in a team. And lastly, it's honestly prioritizing. I think what people think is juggling is like because I'm able to be present in a lot of things, but for me, it's just I prioritize it. Like I'll give you a small example. Um, like uh, if if you don't mind me, like being personal. But how about when your grandmother passed away? That was really important to me because your grandmother was like Ronya, don't make me come this early into the podcast. But like it was an example because some people were like, you're insane to me, right? And they see this outside, like, oh, you're juggling. But I'm like, no, I'm not juggling, I'm making it a priority, right?

SPEAKER_01 23:17

No, guys, guys, Ranya, Ranya came to my grandma's Genaza. Okay. You were what 39 in like two days. Gonna give birth. I was going in for a c-section the day after. Yes, I knew you were close to your birth, and I was shocked that you even came. I was so touched. Then you texted me being like, sorry, I couldn't come to the Haza, but I'm going in for my C-section tomorrow. And I was like, oh my god, the fact that you even came to the Genessa is crazy, but very, very much appreciated and so sweet. But you didn't have to.

SPEAKER_00 23:53

You you know what I mean? This is like in my head, right? This is how I think of it. First, your grandmother was a rock star and she's done so much like super boss lady inspiration behind the whole podcast. Literally, literally, like she was she's my inspiration in so many ways. Like when I think of like who I want to be in the community, I want to be your grandma. Because she was like a boss lady that like everyone respected, she had her place, she never gave up on her, she knew what was right, and she followed it no matter what. And and even like a after she passed, like a lot of stories came up about how she's changed so many things, and even the community has permanently changed because of what she has done. I don't even think when she was doing that, she realized what she was doing.

SPEAKER_01 24:33

She was just like, I need to make money for my six kids, and we have to make it here in America. Yeah, she shaped literally New Jersey forever.

SPEAKER_00 24:41

Literally, right? So I think for me, it was like this woman did all of this. The least I can do is go to her Genazza, right? This was a non-negotiable. Everything else then shifted around that. I think that's what people I think these days don't realize or don't do as much. Is I very much value this stuff in terms of like giving back to the community, building relations with community, building community in general. And then obviously I love you too, and I want to be there for your grandma. Their impact on this community actually did matter, you know? And then obviously it was also because, yeah, I love you and I appreciate you, and I'm there too.

SPEAKER_01 25:13

No, and I appreciated it too. I I just I had no idea that literally the next day was your C-section.

SPEAKER_00 25:19

I knew you were close. What's funny is people see that and they're like, oh, you're really great at juggling. I'm like, no, I just prioritize this very, very much because I get this a lot. Like, why did you show up? I'm it's because I'm making this a priority. So I'm going to give this attention um and I'm gonna juggle everything else out to make it work, but it doesn't make my life easier. I'm not doing it easily or seamlessly.

SPEAKER_01 25:40

And it's a complete attestament to your dedication and your willingness to really prioritize what's important to you, but you also have to really make sure you fill your own cup. I know that statement is overdone at this point, and it sounds like such a fake cliche. In nonprofit space, we talk about this a lot. How can we fill your cup so that you don't burn out so that you are able to give back to the community? But nonprofit within itself is just so taxing and plays such a emotional and physical mental tax on you. So, how do you realistically and sustainably do that?

SPEAKER_00 26:15

I'm gonna be honest and say I haven't fully figured out the answer. Um but I'm trying. One of my goals this year actually is to figure that out because I think I realized, like especially with the last 15 months of genocide and um was myself and my family were very much an afterthought for me, especially in the beginning months. And my body paid the price. I got really, really sick. Um, and I was incapable of anything. I couldn't I couldn't shower myself, I couldn't, I couldn't drive anywhere, I couldn't breathe properly, I couldn't talk properly for like two months. And that was like the biggest wake-up call. I think my body was giving me all these signals that I ignored and I was just like, I'll handle it, I'll handle it, I'll handle it. And then I didn't, and then it hit me all at once. I went from like being super, super independent independent to like super dependent and scared. Like I, you know, I was really scared. I didn't know what was happening, I wasn't getting any answers, and it was just getting worse. But alhamdulillah, that for me has been something that in the back of my mind I've been keeping at the forefront and thinking I need to prioritize myself. So some of the little things that I've been doing is learning to say no, realizing I can't do everything under the sun, um, as much as you know, I feel like I need to sometimes or want to, and and making sure that I'm pacing myself. I've been trying to make some things in my head non-negotiable, right? It's back to the idea of prioritizing. I'm very good at prioritizing other people and other people's needs, but I'm very bad at prioritizing what I need. But I've been trying to do like small things, like saying I need to do this and I'm gonna do this no matter what, and kind of challenging myself to do it, whether that be walking or you know, taking just a minute to myself. You know, it's it's funny because something happened. It's it's a funny story, but I thought it was very deep. I I have a very bad habit of driving my car past empty.

SPEAKER_01 28:06

Yes, yes, yes. I think that's a woman thing, honestly, because I always do that, and my husband always makes sure if he sees it right past half, yeah, he goes right away to the gallery.

SPEAKER_00 28:18

I see it, I see an empty, and I'm like, let's see how many miles I can go. Same, same empty. So one time, and actually, it was in these last 15 months, things were really crazy. I was going from a meeting to a meeting, and so one time it was literally for four days in a row. I was I was driving on below empty. No, no, that was bad. No, but the thing is, and this is the lesson, is that I yes, literally, because I kept saying after this thing, I will stop to get gas, right? Then miraculously I would get to that thing. And I'm not talking about like small drives, I'm talking about like 20-minute drives.

SPEAKER_01 29:00

I don't even know how your car did that for four days.

SPEAKER_00 29:03

I don't know how it did it either, but it was funny because I kept driving. So I went to I had like a lot of meetings and I had a lot of different places I had to go. Like it was high-level things to personal things, it was just a lot happening, and it was just non-stop and back to back for four days. Every day I was like, okay, after I do this, I'm going to go fill up gas. And then miraculously, I'd get to that thing. I didn't run out of gas. So I'm like, okay, I'm just gonna do one more thing. It kept doing that for four days until I was in um a parking lot and I was getting ready to turn into um the parking space and my car stopped. I was shocked. Um, I called my husband. He was in a meeting. Oh, uh, my dad came and helped me fill up gas later. I was telling my husband, I'm like, you can't believe it. The car just stopped. He looked at me and was like, wait, are you being serious right now? He's like, What do you mean you can't believe it? He goes, The car's been telling you for four days you're out of gas and you kept driving. And I thought, yeah, but I didn't think it would actually stop. And then that's when he's like, Maybe you should look at your life because you're kind of in that same place. It was going from thing to thing to thing to thing, thinking, like, after this, I'll rest. After this, I'll take a minute, after this, I'll do that. And then what happened is I got really sick. And I think that was my study, like, oh, I never thought this would happen. And it's like, well, yeah, obviously it's gonna happen. You just have to prepare for it.

SPEAKER_01 30:17

No, literally, what a perfect metaphor. Yeah, it was crazy for your current situation. I was like, God is giving me a sign. Girl, you got blessed with the four-day sign. That was ultimately. And still ignored it. No, it's such a good metaphor, though. To you need to fill up your own tank so that you can have gas for yourself and for everybody else because you will get depleted. I'm really sorry that you had to experience it in the way of you getting sick though, even though the car story was a funny story. But I'm sad that you had to get sick though for you to experience that. And I really hope that you're able to find that balance where you can take care of yourself. You can't keep taking care of others if you don't have anything to give at the end of the day.

SPEAKER_00 31:00

Yeah, and I think you know what I also realized is that when I was giving from a place of emptiness, it was rather than it giving me joy, it was building resentment. And it was kind of ruining the whole purpose of why I was doing a lot of stuff. It was kind of like me reclaiming things when I was like, no, you know what? I want to show up in the best way that I can show up, which means I'm gonna say no to things, I'm gonna take some time to myself, I'm gonna, you know, spend a weekend at home. I'm gonna do this like random clout cleaning day, right? That instead of constantly running from thing to thing, um, to rejuvenate because I I need that, right? Otherwise, I'll just keep going till I don't realize I'm not empty. 2025 will be the year, Danya.

SPEAKER_01 31:42

Even if it's in small ways and small things. Yeah. So a key topic at Siddhi's stories is really highlighting the achievements of Palestinian women. But that also doesn't come like with without hardship. It's kind of like what we've been talking about so far is that it's it's not as easy as it looks on the outside. What has been the biggest highlight, and then what has also been the biggest challenge?

SPEAKER_00 32:05

I think my biggest highlight was actually the day we did the Palestine Way unveiling because I think that for me was when I realized the impact of the work that we had been doing up until that point.

SPEAKER_01 32:19

That was That was tangible. That was really tangible. That was showing up in such a big way. I was visiting and I got emotional. This is a community that I remember being little and it started off so small. It was my uncle's store, my grandparents' store, these small little mom-pop shops. And to see it just in such a big way, yeah, it was truly inspiring.

SPEAKER_00 32:41

It really was. And I think that I remember like sitting there and just really soaking it in, like looking at the crowds of people, looking at the sign up and thinking this is a moment you're gonna want to remember forever, and inshallah tell your grandkids one day about it.

SPEAKER_01 32:57

Um you did that, Anya.

SPEAKER_00 32:59

I mean, no, no, I did not do that. In fact, that was a keen community effort. Yeah, it was a good rewarding moment of realizing like this is the point of the work we do, you know. Can you tell people what that is? I know Patterson renamed part of Main Street about I think four blocks or six blocks into Palestine Way, uh, which is a huge monumental thing for us because, like Leila said, we've grown up going to stores on Main Street. It's always been mom and pop shops, but renaming it, and now when you go on Palestine Way, it's just turning right on Palestine Way and you see the sign. It's just it's really beautiful to have that. It's always has been a gathering place, but it's become even more of that since the renaming of Palestine Way. South Patterson was always a hot spot and everyone from across the country went there. But it's become even much more in the last, you know, few years since that renaming. It was just beautiful to see the community coming together, the flags in the air. I close my eyes and I still see that moment. I'm always very like go, go, go, go, go. And I remember that was a moment I was like, take a second, breathe, and really take in this moment because it was it was monumental. And now it's my daughter and my sons are gonna grow up with the memory of Palestine Way, which is such a beautiful thing to have. Like they're not gonna know it not existing, you know? And what is it?

SPEAKER_01 34:14

And it's a real way to put your stamp on things as a Palestinian community. We are here, we exist. It's now literally even in the GPS. What better way to really show that you're there, you're thriving, and your community is not going to be erased, your identity is not going to be erased.

SPEAKER_00 34:31

Yeah, and it was a tangible thing that we as a community center have gotten to. We're working on institution building, we were working on long-term change, we were working on systemic change in the community. And seeing that up there that day, it was like, yes, that this is it. This is the point of the work that we're doing. Obviously, that's not the long-term goal, inshallah, as a free Palestine, but this was like a small, small, really exciting thing that I think lifted a lot of spirits. That it's like, if we could do this here, we can do a lot more. And I think it really helped encourage the community, really livened up the community. Since then, actually, it's been great because there's been a lot more movement in the community, which it always has happened, but it's I feel it's increased since that. Um, because it's again, it's like a morale boost. Like, oh, this happened. Well, what else can we do? You know, what else can we make? Yeah. I think also it was a moment of recognizing all of the giants that came before us that made this moment possible, like your grandmother, like our families, like like everybody. Like they're the ones who started this path and were reaping the benefits in a way. So that was also something I did take that moment and really think about it. I was like, how many people had to sacrifice and how many people had to work for us to get to this moment of being able to name, which I know it's not like, you know, it's not the end of the day because some people's like, oh, it's just an it's but it is monumental. If it's a huge monumental, symbolic win. Um, and I think it's it transformed a lot of things since then. It's like uh a tribute to the now and the past.

SPEAKER_01 35:55

Seeing a huge sign with the name Palestine Way, so important for representation and for our kids to grow up and be like, yeah, we've always been here. I don't think it's something to belittle whatsoever. I think you guys did an awesome job. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:10

The challenges, there's a few, but the one that I come into mind is um, I think balancing motherhood while being on this journey of being an executive director for a community center has been one of my greatest challenges that I have constantly struggled with. And I think that people don't recognize or appreciate or fully understand what that means. I find myself in a lot of times I'm the only woman in the room. That's always been my struggle. Trying to see how I can give myself grace while also asserting myself as usually the only woman in the room while also staying true to who I am as a person, as a mom, as you know, all these other parts of my identity.

SPEAKER_01 36:52

How do you navigate that?

SPEAKER_00 36:55

It's hard. It's really hard. Something that I've done is I've been very intentional about making PAC a space that's safe for families and safe for working moms, and actually encourages working moms to be able to balance being a mom and working. I think a lot of times it's actually being vocal about it and saying, you know what? No, I can't do this because this doesn't work with my schedule right now. Because you know what? I'm a mom. I've been working all day. I can't come to an event in the evening because I have to spend it with my kids, or bringing my kids to work and making sure that, you know, they have different things. It's hard because a lot of times I think the way that our society works and the way that Western feminism works is this idea of you shouldn't say, I'm a mom, so I feel these things. But I actually think that that's a huge disservice to us because I think that society should be able to accept us as women who are mothers and should actually change their standards for us rather than us change our standards for them. Does that make sense?

SPEAKER_01 37:53

100%. Yeah, 100%. How do you go about creating a community like that or like a space like that for women?

SPEAKER_00 38:01

So, first is I try to lead by example. I remember um, you know, like I've been invited to a couple of conferences to go to as an attendee uh on behalf of PAC, and my kids were young, like they were being nursed. So first thing I was like, hey, can I bring them with me? Like I need to, I need to be able to bring them with me. I am a mom and I do want to be present with my kids' life. There's nothing to be ashamed of that, right? I can be super career oriented and super present for my children. It doesn't have to be one or the other. And I think our society makes us choose. It's constantly in that like frame. And I think that what's most harming us is when as women we don't understand that and we don't give each other grace. But what I do is I try to lead by example. My kids are there with me a lot. So, you know, I find ways to entertain them or figure out things that they could do while I'm in a meeting, or I also help with childcare. Now, a lot of people in our center, for example, are getting babies, are growing their families. I've always been like, bring your kids. You could do both. Never feel like you have to choose. As long as it makes sense. But it's I think it's about normalizing things. Like there's nothing wrong with saying, you know what, I didn't sleep last night and I'm having a hard time today. Like it's okay. Like, I feel like there's so much taboo around what it means to become a mom, what is postpartum period? What does it look like that we try to hide a lot of this stuff and we're not real with people? We don't really share the reality of things. But when you're able to provide that environment, which I try to do at PAC, like come as you are with whatever struggles you have, and let's try to figure things out. I think that's that's how our grandmothers had it.

SPEAKER_01 39:30

Our grandmothers in the Belad, they had a whole village to help take care of their kids and take care of their families. Exactly. We were not able to do it by ourselves. This notion that we can do it all, we can do it all by ourselves, is it's literally harming only ourselves.

SPEAKER_00 39:44

It's a Western concept. Like it's it's not something that we grew up with, it's not something that we understood. We're very collective and communal. Then it comes to the most important job in the world, which is raising the next generation. It's like, no, no, no, you have to do that all by yourself. And if you're not doing it by yourself, you're a failure. How does that make any sense? We need the village. It does take a village. Sometimes not everybody has that village, right? But it's then it's on us to build that village and it's on us to feel like you know, we're gonna work together to make this work. What does that mean? Is showing up with grace and showing up where people are at and understanding their circumstances and not having this absurd reality of what is. I, for example, just had a baby baby recently, and this is the first time that I've kind of tried to disappear a little bit, but even then, I haven't girl, you have not been disappointed. This isn't me trying.

SPEAKER_01 40:30

This is actually me trying to disappear. Seeing you on the pack Instagram, and I'm like, mashallah how is up doing this. Girl, take a break. You need a break.

SPEAKER_00 40:41

So this is me trying to disappear, but it's it's it's funny because like there's no grace that's given in that sense. Like, I feel like I'm not always given that grace of you should disappear for a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 40:52

Like, you know, like I'm I'm sure the past 15 months like has also been an a huge impacting factor on that.

SPEAKER_00 40:59

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 41:00

How has that impacted your role within PAC?

SPEAKER_00 41:04

For November, December of last year, I barely used to see my kids. Luckily that I have, you know, all my in-laws are here, my parents are here, so they just took over the kids for three months. Um, obviously with my husband. They just together, everybody just took over the kids and and managed it because it was. That was your village.

SPEAKER_01 41:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:21

That's also what a lot of people don't realize is being in the position that we are as packed. We were getting calls from all areas, from people losing their jobs, from students getting threatened to be kicked out of school, from people in Rezda trying to evacuate, from American families trying to get their families out, from like politicians wanting to meet. Like we've met with all levels of politicians in New Jersey. We were organizing actions from protests to press releases to info workbooks, and we were also going from place to place doing educational workshops. We were invited to speak at like an endless amount of events because people wanted to know more about what's happening in Palestine. So it was just constant go, go, go, go, go. I remember at one point I felt I literally had a constant buzzing in my head because you didn't even have a second to grieve because it was the only way you could grieve was jump into action. It was let's go from this action to the next action.

SPEAKER_01 42:15

How do you find the energy or like the motivation to kind of keep going within this work?

SPEAKER_00 42:22

The energy at that time, honestly, was I think the way I channeled my grief was through action. I'm not the type to sit in a corner and just cry. I don't do that. I can't sit. I have to do the next thing. I felt incredibly guilty, as a lot of us felt. There's a lot of survivors' guilt that was there. And I felt like I cannot rest until I've done everything in my capability that I can. And I just kept going. I think I was kind of like in a little bit of an out-of-body experience where it was like, next, next, next. We have to touch every single thing possible in order to make sure that we've done everything that we can. Also, on a personal level, I kept thinking one day on the day of judgment, we're all gonna be asked about this. And what am I gonna say? I still obviously, even despite everything that we've done, I feel like obviously we haven't done enough. There's still so much more to do. That was really pushing me. Like that was my motivation I need to do everything I can. And those videos, the endless videos like that are scarred in our memories forever, you would see it was just the grief. I don't think I processed the grief until months, months later. When I had a second to slow down, when my body forced me to slow down, is when I started processing the grief a little bit. But even then, I still think we haven't fully processed the grief. How do you go about processing the grief? I think action is the number one way. I think that as long as that grief is alive and is awake in each and every one of us, we continue to challenge ourselves and continue to ask ourselves what can we do? What have we not done? And what is there left to do? I think as long as we have that motivating us, we keep acting. I think a lot of it too is shifting for me. I had to shift from short-term thinking to long-term thinking because a lot of our work in the beginning was very response oriented, but it kind of shifted to, you know what? The same way I have to take a beat and pace myself in order to be here long term. Pac also needs to take a beat and pace itself to be here long term. And PAC hasn't didn't just exist in the last 15 months. Pac has been here in the last 10 years. We've done so much towards long-term change in the last 10 years. We need to keep working it. We need to keep building. And that's it. I think that really motivates me. In terms of grieving, honestly, I don't know. I think I think it's hard to grieve when, you know, the people in Gazda can't even properly grieve. Yeah. Um, I I know now with the temporary ceasefire, it's like people are getting a little bit of a breath to breathe, but it's still like, how can you but you're just holding your breath the whole time?

SPEAKER_01 44:48

Like you're not releasing, you're just like tensing up, holding your breath, waiting for the next thing. You can't actively grieve if you're still going through it. And especially, like you said, if if we're still seeing our Palestinian brothers and sisters who are in Falloutine go through it.

SPEAKER_00 45:02

Um, and right now it's it's maybe Rezda calmed down a little bit, but now you're seeing it in Janine and you're seeing it in the West Bank. It's it kind of puts that fire under you that we have this American privilege because of many series of events that happened before we existed. We're here and we're not there. So we need to hold that responsibility and do whatever capacity is. You know, everybody has the capacity to do every single thing in the planet, but you could do little things that you have that capacity to do to keep this at the forefront of your mind and honor all of the lives that have been killed in the struggle.

SPEAKER_01 45:36

What is the future for PAC and how can people get involved in its mission?

SPEAKER_00 45:42

So, PAC's future, I want to say the immediate future of PAC is sustainability. I'm really trying to work on making things as sustainable as possible in every way, whether that be through our policies, our procedures, financially, how we run things, our staffing, our programs, the long-term development, and then continue expanding our work. Also, eventually and ideally, in a world where we have so many people's help, it can become something that exists and not only in New Jersey, it can exist in many places and many locations. I know that that's definitely a huge goal. I don't feel like we're there yet to be able to do it, but it's definitely something in the future. I know more immediately in the future, we are working on a museum project where back to the idea of stories, we're actually trying to center our community stories through this museum project.

SPEAKER_01 46:27

I've been keeping up with that and I've been absolutely obsessed. I can't wait for the next one to come on. Can you tell people where they can follow along with that?

SPEAKER_00 46:38

Yeah, so we have our website www.paccusa.org. We're also on social media. It's typically at P A C P A C C USA. We're on Instagram, a Facebook. On Facebook, we're Palestinian American Community Center. So it's a little different. But we're we post regularly on all our social media outlets. We also have a YouTube channel. We definitely encourage people to support in any way that they can. So there's a lot in store for PAC. In everybody to join us in our journey. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 47:06

Congratulations on 10 years.

SPEAKER_00 47:07

Thank you. It's a huge accomplishment.

SPEAKER_01 47:09

It was. Well, Ronia, thank you so much for sharing your story and your incredible work with us today. It's truly inspiring to hear how you're amplifying the voices of our community and creating real change in current time. I seriously appreciate having you on.

SPEAKER_00 47:23

Thank you, Leila. This is an amazing project, and I wish it much, much success. And I can't wait to hear many, many more podcasts. And I'm very proud of you, and I think this is so great.

SPEAKER_01 47:33

Thank you for joining us on this episode of Siddhi Stories, where we honor the voices and highlight the achievements of Palestinian women. We hope this conversation left you feeling connected, empowered, and maybe even inspired to engage more deeply with your own identity and community. And hopefully, most importantly, serve as a reminder to fill your own tank. I linked the pack website in this episode's description so you can support in any way you feel comfortable. Until next time, may we continue to gather and preserve the stories of our cities.